I also believe in allowing insurance companies to choose whether or not to fund it as well. If NARAL wants abortions free for poor families so badly, let 'em hold a bake sale and raise the funds themselves.

I agree on all points.  While I am personally against it for moral reasons, I think the answer is to make it unpalatable. And let the public decide.  I am not going to force my beliefs on anyone (sorry Dabe), but I will try to convince all to vote against it.  For that is where I am at.  In a representative democracy.

#15 by Dr. Guy Sunday, October 09, 2005

and how about the lefts precious "let homosexuals adopt" they never seem to correlate the two. Your writing has indeed gotten a lot more insightful! And that is very insightful! Have a cookie

yummy...COOKIE!!! and thank you doc.

16 by Dr. Guy Sunday, October 09, 2005

I also believe in allowing insurance companies to choose whether or not to fund it as well. If NARAL wants abortions free for poor families so badly, let 'em hold a bake sale and raise the funds themselves. I agree on all points. While I am personally against it for moral reasons, I think the answer is to make it unpalatable. And let the public decide. I am not going to force my beliefs on anyone (sorry Dabe), but I will try to convince all to vote against it. For that is where I am at. In a representative democracy.

yeh what ever happened to putting something to a vote instead of having SCOTUS make new laws for you. The left only things that matter to them should have scotus make laws about, Somehow the DEMOCRATIC party is not very democratic.

7 by Dr. Guy Sunday, October 09, 2005 Just what we need, more unwanted children.Prove that an adopted child is unwanted.prove it!yeh , but no proof is needed doc, it must be true because he said so.

Yeah it is fine for those that are adopted (I never said children that ARE adopted are unwanted by the way (my uncle was adopted BTW), but I know how you like fight straw men). What about those that spend their entire lives going from foster home to foster home. Oh no I forgot every child must get adopted because you implictly said so. Talking of proof, where is your proof that abortions are getting out of control or an abused procedure as you put it?

All you'll achieve is women and girls risking illegal or DIY abortions, thus risking two lives instead of one. Going to a different state might be easy for a women with a job and a supportive family with money, but what about a teen girl who has made a mistake? You it should be allowed in certain exceptional circumstances but what of those very circumstances make it harder either physically/socially or emotionally to go throught the process of getting exemptions (like it wasn't hard enough already)? Either you have thorough ways of checking they are truly exempt or you will people will use those exemptions as a loophole, for example a sympathic doctor who will fudge the records and claim the women's life is in danger.

and how about the lefts precious "let homosexuals adopt" they never seem to correlate the two.Your writing has indeed gotten a lot more insightful! And that is very insightful! Have a cookie!

I'm pro-homosexual adoption but I don't see how it reduces the problem of kids who get passed up year after year because they have a disability, or they are too old or whatever.

If you do not like your states abortion law, move to a state that allows abortion or keep your legs closed, use preventive measures.

I agree prevention is better than anything else but people should have a choice, especially where their body is concerned. You may think it is a easy thing to go through pregnancy and have to give up your child (wanted or not) but perhaps that is because you are men (as am I, but assume I couldn't imagine what it is like either). You seem to think that all these women are taking it lightly and that going through abortion is easy for them (or even think that giving up a baby for adoption is easy). Did you ever think it might be the hardest decision of their lives? No. You just look the numbers (well maybe not, since you don't seem to show any actual basis in fact for you claim that abortion is abused) and assume that they throwing out fetuses like they are a piece of rubbish because it is a decision you have never had to, and never will have to make.

You bring up partial birth abortion like it is a common thing. Most abortions are D'n' Cs within the first 13 weeks.

From what I have heard in the US abortion have actually been decreasing, at least they were until 2000. Link

But hey it isn't your life or your body so why have any empathy for other people?

I am not trying to be a pest her bu tI have a question.

"I feel that abortion is an abused procedure, in too many cases a child is destroyed like an animal because it's inconvenient to give birth at this time"

I was just wondering how you came to that conclusion? Any statistics or numbers and percetnages or did you just figure that it is abused because you felt it in your heart. I mean under what conditions is "abused" anyway? How many of unwanted pregnancies are caused by contraception failure and aborted?

Just a question. I am the curious type.

I cocnur with Gid's postition though.

But hey it isn't your life or your body so why have any empathy for other people?

I forget who here at JU said it...but any aborted babies that are for abortion, raise your hand.....

I wonder, toblerone, do you wish you were aborted? Because if you don't....and if you were not aborted....then where is YOUR arguement?

I wonder, toblerone, do you wish you were aborted? Because if you don't....and if you were not aborted....then where is YOUR arguement?

I'm talking about the mother not the aborted fetus.

Of course I don't wish I was aborted, that would be a bit self-defetused.

Note: Toblerone has now been sent directly to hell for both being pro-abortion and using a terrible pun, but he's loving it.

Reply By: TobleronePosted: Sunday, October 09, 20057 by Dr. Guy Sunday, October 09, 2005 Just what we need, more unwanted children.Prove that an adopted child is unwanted.prove it!yeh , but no proof is needed doc, it must be true because he said so. Yeah it is fine for those that are adopted (I never said children that ARE adopted are unwanted by the way (my uncle was adopted BTW), but I know how you like fight straw men). What about those that spend their entire lives going from foster home to foster home. Oh no I forgot every child must get adopted because you implictly said so. Talking of proof, where is your proof that abortions are getting out of control or an abused procedure as you put it?

so am I to take that , istead of having a child in foster care it would have been better off aborted? your uncle seems to be a good reason to not abort.

and how about the lefts precious "let homosexuals adopt" they never seem to correlate the two.Your writing has indeed gotten a lot more insightful! And that is very insightful! Have a cookie!I'm pro-homosexual adoption but I don't see how it reduces the problem of kids who get passed up year after year because they have a disability, or they are too old or whatever.

haave to agree here, life just ain't fair sometimes, but I am sure many good people came from foster care homes and live productive lives.

You bring up partial birth abortion like it is a common thing. Most abortions are D'n' Cs within the first 13 weeks

I think one is too much.

From what I have heard in the US abortion have actually been decreasing, at least they were until 2000. LinkBut hey it isn't your life or your body so why have any empathy for other people?

Just a question how many children are killed in the lowest year of abortion?

Reply By: DPSPosted: Sunday, October 09, 2005I am not trying to be a pest her bu tI have a question."I feel that abortion is an abused procedure, in too many cases a child is destroyed like an animal because it's inconvenient to give birth at this time"I was just wondering how you came to that conclusion? Any statistics or numbers and percetnages or did you just figure that it is abused because you felt it in your heart. I mean under what conditions is "abused" anyway? How many of unwanted pregnancies are caused by contraception failure and aborted? Just a question. I am the curious type.

by listening, and by experence, my oldest had an abortion because it was not a good time in her life to have a child, something that still haunts her btw.

Reply By: MythicalMinoPosted: Sunday, October 09, 2005But hey it isn't your life or your body so why have any empathy for other people?I forget who here at JU said it...but any aborted babies that are for abortion, raise your hand.....I wonder, toblerone, do you wish you were aborted? Because if you don't....and if you were not aborted....then where is YOUR arguement?

odd question, would like to know the answer though.

Reply By: TobleronePosted: Monday, October 10, 2005I wonder, toblerone, do you wish you were aborted? Because if you don't....and if you were not aborted....then where is YOUR arguement?I'm talking about the mother not the aborted fetus. Of course I don't wish I was aborted, that would be a bit self-defetused.Note: Toblerone has now been sent directly to hell for both being pro-abortion and using a terrible pun, but he's loving

I do not think someone goes to hell for how they feel about this issue. Nor do I think it's my place to tell you how to think about this issue either.

but what about a teen girl who has made a mistake?

Then she should face the consequences of her mistake rather than murdering her child. If you killed a two year old because it was inconvenient, you would go to jail. To me, it's the same. To some people, if they're young enough it doesn't count as killing someone.

I don't think that anyone disagrees that murdering children is wrong, we just disagree on what constitutes a child.

Yeah it is fine for those that are adopted (I never said children that ARE adopted are unwanted by the way (my uncle was adopted BTW), but I know how you like fight straw men). What about those that spend their entire lives going from foster home to foster home. Oh no I forgot every child must get adopted because you implictly said so. Talking of proof, where is your proof that abortions are getting out of control or an abused procedure as you put it?

Once you prove your point, I will prove mine.  Or you can google it.

I believe except for extreme cases, IE: mothers life at risk, rape, incest, abortion should be banned on the federal level and left up to individual states.

In the case of rape, does the right of the mother to not carry the child of the rapist outway the child's right to live? If so, is the child's right to live a lesser right? If so, wouldn't that open the door for more abortions based on the principle that the child's right to live is not a real right?

And what does it mean when you say "banned on the federal level and left up to individual states"? Do you think abortion should be banned on the federal level XOR do you think it should be left up to individual states? The two are mutually exclusive.

Gideon has a point. Abortions shouldn't be tax-funded or subsidised. All the arguments for tax-funded or subsidised healthcare boil down to allowing the poor to have decent healthcare. But why this applies to abortions, I cannot see (except in cases where the mother's life is in danger). Abortions are, to put it bluntly, more cosmetic than required to survive. Having a child is not a chronic illness.

As for adoption, perhaps the rules should be changed to make it easier to adopt. Of course many of the rules are probably in place to protect the workers of adoption centres. Something must be done to protect them so they don't have to worry so much about who they give these kids to. It's impossible to both hold them accountable AND accelerate the process. If they are fully accountable, they WILL stall the process, to protect the children and ultimately to protect themselves.

I think outlawing abortion (except when medically necessary) and allowing gay couples to adopt and streamlining the adoption process could be a good compromise.

27 by Spc Nobody Special Monday, October 10, 2005

but what about a teen girl who has made a mistake? Then she should face the consequences of her mistake rather than murdering her child. If you killed a two year old because it was inconvenient, you would go to jail. To me, it's the same. To some people, if they're young enough it doesn't count as killing someone. I don't think that anyone disagrees that murdering children is wrong, we just disagree on what constitutes a child.

wow you mean that someone should take RESPONSIBILITY for there mistakes? wow what a concept.